Saddam Bin Laden

[judecorp]

I am terrified about this whole war thing.

Am I the only person out there who is completely and totally boggled with the smokescreen that our presidential administration is blowing around? I mean, all we used to hear about was Osama Bin Laden. I mean, his name was thrown around three bazillion times a day. And everything was "September 11" this and "terrorists" that and Osama Osama Osama.

Funny that we're /still/ totally inundated with the throwing around of the terms "September 11," "terrorist," and "homeland security." But it seems that Osama Bin Laden has now been replaced with Saddam Hussein. It's as if our administration went "Presto! Change-o!" and suddenly Hussein is behind the World Trade Center tragedy.

Am I the only person who has noticed this? Has everyone else been totally sucked in and blindsided? Frankly, it makes me sick.

Comments

[cappucinogrrl.livejournal.com]

Hear hear.

Yeah, I was wondering exactly how the shift changed from bin Laden to Saddam. Where did all of this Iraq stuff come from? Was it just, "well, we can't get bin Laden, so we'll have to settle for killing somebody else America hates?" That's my guess.

I started another letter to you by the way. Maybe I'll even finish this one.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

OOOOH! A LETTER!

[mightywombat.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I just don't believe that the American people are so totally fooled by the smokescreen the president's media wonks are blowing out. It hurts me...

[chutup.livejournal.com]

I just don't believe that the American people are so totally fooled

geez. what fantasy world do you live in? can i go there?

i look around me and all i see is self-absorbed, suv driving, heinekin drinking suburbanite assholes. they probably don't know that bin laden and hussein are two different people. as far as they know, oceania has always been at war with east asia.

then again, i do work in dublin.

Re:

[mightywombat.livejournal.com]

Well, okay. The American people ARE totally fooled, I just can't believe that they let themselves be so totally fooled by something that so many others are seeing through...


"The Person is smart. People are dumb, panicky animals, you know that."

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Love you.

Re:

[chutup.livejournal.com]

do me

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Not for 3-4 weeks.

Re:

[chutup.livejournal.com]

wha????
why the wait? >:)

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

No oral contact. SAD. :(

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I guess it comes down to the fact that people believe what they want to believe. Like the Bible. You can find a quote to suit your every whim.

[siercia]

I've certainly noticed. But what exactly is there to do. He's already made it pretty clear he's not listening to the anti-war public.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

He's already made it pretty clear he's not listening to the anti-war public.

Well, he wasn't listening to the popular vote, either. *sigh*

But I think by giving up because "he won't listen anyway" is probably exactly what he wants. Even if he discounts every single anti-war thing I/we do, he can't make us go away. I won't let apathy keep me from speaking about what I think is right. I can't. I wouldn't be able to look at myself.

A Thinker Question...

[infinite-love.livejournal.com]

My friend and I were just discussing this exact same thing over dinner tonight!!!! She knows alot more about this stuff than I do, and all that I know is from online news, and classroom discussions...and the stuff my dad and I talk about. The thing that I couldn't figure out is if we still ARE chasing Bin Laden around, or if all our focus was now completely on Saddam. I completely agree with you that the focus has been shifted from Bin Laden to Saddam, and alot of people are choosing not to see it.

Another question: does anyone wonder why we are choosing not to focus on the problems with North Korea, and the fact that they are advanced farther with nuclear weapons than Iraq? One of my professors' theory is that North Korea is going to wait until we go to war with Iraq, and than bomb us with their nuclear weapons. Wait for the US to be diverted than attack.

Supposedly I guess Iraq is, in theory, destroying their missiles, and the threat of attack on US soil has been released a bit...but I don't know. I find it hard to believe that Iraq is going to destroy those missiles and gas prices are going to go down to 99 cents a gallon. Nothing is that easy, and something has to give. I think there is going to be some form of violence, whether or not Iraq destroys those missiles.

And doesn't it seem like everything was calm before Bush got in office; yet now that he has established himself we are going to war with 17 different countries, our allies don't even want to get involved in our mess, our deficit is growing, and women are soon to lose the right to our bodies. Maybe the problems were still there during the Clinton Administration, but they were so overshadowed by who he was having sex with.

Hmmm...blah blah blah...It is late, and these are just my thoughts.

Re: A Thinker Question...

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Well, the whole Iraq thing, really, is just to pick up where Bush Sr. didn't get to finish. And that has got to be the saddest reason to kill a bunch of people if I ever saw one.

Funny, we weren't at war with Iraq for 8 years and nothing happened. But then we get a monkey in office and everyone, even our /allies/ hate us.

Yay.

Re: A Thinker Question...

[oddharmonic.livejournal.com]

We're still chasing Bin Laden, though I can't really guess to what extent at the moment. (My ear is a few thousand miles away from me right now, but he's normally spot-on. I can ask him in my next letter; he's limited to postal mail until April. *grumble* Lousy penal system, he's about as dangerous as a brick of cheese.)

The two major things floating around the military on why we're not going after Korea yet:
- Iraq is an easier nut to crack ("jungle warfare" puts fear into me the way "land war in Asia" should have in certain German leaders during WWII) and
- Korea is harder to sell the public on supporting.

For now I don't have a whole lot more to say on it, but e-mail discourse is always welcome.

In the meanwhile, I'll share the advice of my evil twin (I'm a few hours older, but you could join us -- we were born on 9 Aug 80) tinder: "The world of shit is about ready to get flushed, buckle your face belts."

[oddharmonic.livejournal.com]

I'm bothered by it, but I have to watch my words on it since Robert's still in... suffice it to say neither of us are in favor of this war and something Robert said about it last year is why he's not re-enlisting. (Suffice it to say he won't be getting the last "easy" promotion nearly everyone gets in their first 4 years and he can't re-enlist even if he wanted to -- and we'd planned on him being in for 8 so I could finish my undergrad work before he got out.)

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

You mean they won't take him because he said something? Really?

[oddharmonic.livejournal.com]

They won't take him for a second enlistment; his initial four year enlistment ends later this year.

Last June, while talking with coworkers about the Middle East, he voiced his concerns about Dubya starting a war and said he wouldn't want to fight if he had to fight with draftees. (His regular comment on the latter is that he "doesn't want to fight alongside [people] who don't want to be there".)

Someone overheard only the tail end of his statement and, without consulting anyone that was part of the conversation, reported that R. made anti-military and anti-American comments. Since he's not on anyone's good side (he does his job well, but he's antisocial) it resulted in a swift smackdown. Initially threatened with discharge, base legal backed him up that the situation didn't warrant discharge. (The appropriate punishment would be an LOR [Letter of Reprimand] on the guilty party's file.) R. was given a denial of re-enlistment and appealed, but it was denied within an hour of filing.

So it's been done with for months and he can't re-enlist, but the denial doesn't apply if he were to go full-time National Guard (where he wouldn't lose time and rank), so that's a consideration for our plans once we move back to Colorado this fall.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Oh dear god.

Good luck with the plans!

[khaosworks.livejournal.com]

No, no everyone has been blindsided. Many, many people realize this and have been talking about it. The problem is it hasn't really hit the public consciousness in any meaningful way. The other problem is whether or not George "I don't care what the polls say, I'm doing this in the interest of national security" Dubya Bush actually cares.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

True.

Dammit.

[lemur68.livejournal.com]

There was a story on Yahoo news today, I didn't click on the link to read it but the headline was "[Afghan President] Karzai Reminds US Of Afghan Commitments". Brackets mine, because who the hell remembers who Hamid Karzai is because there's fuck-all about him and the status of the current post-Taliban Afghan regime and our role in rebuilding that nation in the news because who cares about Afghanistan because their main export is rocks and rugs but so what we can just get all our rugs from Armenia anyway and oh yeah we were addressing the tenuous link between Saddam and Al-Qaeda and why we've forgotten about bin Laden GOOD QUESTION.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I know this is all totally serious, but I keep hearing "rocks and rugs" in my head and it is making me giggle. A lot. Like, a lot a lot.

[chaptal.livejournal.com]

I'm not terrified, but disgusted. This administration has pulled the wool over this country's eyes and has shifted its inability to capture or kill Bin Laden with this new scenario about Iraq. It's also a nice diversion from the incompetent economic policies of these idiots.

And people, especially the mainstream media, have bought it and have turned into robotic cheerleaders of doom.

I think an invasion of Iraq will be quick, with fewer lives lost than predicted. Rememeber that elite republican guard in the gulf war? The same one that threw down its weapons at the sight of a Hummer. The big costs will be the cleanup of the oilfields Hussein destroys, and installation of a new type of puppet govermnent - not unlike the travesty going on in Afghanistan now...:/

[lemur68.livejournal.com]

and installation of a new type of puppet govermnent - not unlike the travesty going on in Afghanistan now...:/

exACTly. They're promising a flourishing Westernized society a la post-WWII Germany & Japan, but at this point my money's on a Yugoslavia scenario. I'm surprised Afghanistan hasn't already turned into a bunch of warring fiefdoms.

[chaptal.livejournal.com]

It might already be a bunch of warlords taking control of different areas of the country, our media hasn't the wherewithall or brains to report it.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

...especially because we've totally abandoned Afghanistan.

Like last time, I'm /terrified/ of the environmental ramifcations.

[crazyveigh.livejournal.com]

I have ten million opinions about the whole war thing; From day one when Bush was elected, I just knew that somehow some way he would make us have a war! why!? because a war would overshadow the fact that he SUCKS as a president. it has to be all perfect for the history books and shit.. president bush kept the country cool under war, blah, blah, blah, nice way to cover up the fact that you suck, killing people. brillant.. :/ I used to love politics and then when Dumbya won, It all just went to shit. I have no faith in any of it any more. being president isn't something kids should even wanta grow up to be anymore now. it's like, ANYONE can be president for the right price. Fuck it all.[/end=bitchy-rant-heather-gets-pissy-thinking-about-bush-and-i'm-also-UI-right-now-sorry]

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

being president isn't something kids should even wanta grow up to be anymore now.

It seems to be celebrity status rather than to be treated with the respect and heaviness that it deserves. Now it is just a popularity contest with two or three buzz words thrown in for good measure.

[pica-nc.livejournal.com]

I teach English I (freshmen) in a rural town in the almost-south and a lot of our conversations lately have been shifting to the impending war. Way out here, I'm softly echoing your thoughs.

Known for my civil disobedience (and I've only been in NC for a whole 6 months), I can't help but feel like "way out here" our cries for peace aren't being heard. It seems that literally NO ONE supports this, not even those who are paid to support the president. And no one knows where Iraq came into play in this "homeland security" propeganda.

All I can hear think of is Country Joe MacDonald's "Fixin' to Die" rag... one, two, three.... what are we fighting for?...

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Oh, I think they're being heard, and then summarily and immediately ignored.

[indigodove.livejournal.com]

I see through it. It alternately paralyzes me with fear and makes me sick to my stomach. Gives me nightmares, the whole ten yards.

Hugs to you. I still see some hope the war will be avoided, albeit not much.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I have hope, too. I have hope because in my heart I know it's the right thing.

I don't want my hope to be squashed. :(

[draggongrl.livejournal.com]

The only reason that G. Dubbya has it in for Saddam, is because if his dad's 'attempted assination' thing when he was in office. Dubbya had it in his head from the moment he got in office. I think it was all a conspiracy... the whole "911" thing. I think they planned it and now bcuz of it, Dubbya has an excuse to get Saddam because "he's in on it"! Bush is our problem, it all started when he was elected. Fuck Republicians! We need to get him the hell outta office and America will be fine again.

[draggongrl.livejournal.com]

...sorry for my fuckerd up spelling... i forgot to preview it

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I don't want to think that 9/11 was planned. But I agree that Dubya needs to go!

Re:

[draggongrl.livejournal.com]

We know who NOT to vote for next election... :)