I always get a little sad in the face of homophobia.

[judecorp]

There was a post on strangeland.net recently about Brokeback Mountain which sparked a conversation, of course, on the morality (or lack thereof) of homosexuality. At one point, the original poster answered a comment and stated that he believed homosexuality is wrong (which is fine) and that it should be re-criminalized. And I was just so stunned.

Even though I know it's ridiculous to make the comparison, I always become sad when people equate same-sex relationships with murder and pedophilia. I just don't see how someone, even someone that doesn't know me more than what I do for a living and some of my political leanings, can compare me to a murderer or want to make me a criminal.

It just breaks my heart. Maybe I wouldn't care as much if morality and being a good person weren't so important to me, but I can't help it. I'm heartbroken.

Comments

[estrange.livejournal.com]

That's horrible. :(

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Yuck.

[poopsmoothie.livejournal.com]

funny how people criminalize other people for acts that hurt no one.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I agree that there is a ridiculous amount of criminalization - but I think that's probably the extent of our agreement. IIRC, you want to close all the prisons, something I don't advocate in the slightest.

[oxlahun.livejournal.com]

Re-criminalized? I think it's still illegal in a lot of places.

A few years back, somebody pointed out that alcohol was clearly the root of a lot of social problems in this country. They got a lot of folks to agree with them, and managed to get the stuff banned. Funny thing, though: it didn't work. We still had social problems. Arguably, more of them. Plus we had a lot of pissed off people. Turns out morality is something you have to cultivate, not legislate.

Personally, I think being a bigoted moronic asshole is clearly immoral (far more so that someone who falls in love with a person instead of their complementary genitalia, anyway), and should be punishable by something that just barely slips under the "cruel and unusual" line in the Eighth Amendment, including but not limited to removing these people from positions of authority and the gene pool.

For some reason, nobody has put me in charge of that yet.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Well, I'm pretty sure that when the US Supreme Court ruled that the right to privacy overrode states' sodomy laws, all sodomy laws had to come off the books. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that's the dilly-yo.

I know that being a bigoted, moronic asshole is certainly against MY moral code. Bring it!

[vorpalbla.livejournal.com]

Look, there are probably people in this here country, especially but not exclusively in "flyover land", who would vote for the burning of witches, had they the opportunity and if their local clergy endorsed it. There are extremist Christians just like extremist Muslims, they just do the media thing differently. And they don't HAVE to behead hostages or bomb trains and buses because they can exert so much democratic power--but I suspect some would.

And sadly, I can't agree with the definition in your userpic. For some, yeah, the insecurity plays a part, but for others gay=evil is simply an axiom with which they've been brought up.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Is "just growing up" with an axiom enough of a reason to keep it going? It saddens me that all people don't analyze and make their own judgments on things they were raised with or heard as children.

I grew up with a lot of racist jokes/comments. Does that justify any racist behavior on my part? Is there not a level of insecurity behind all hate speech/crimes?

[vorpalbla.livejournal.com]

Justify, no. Sad, yes. Surprising, not really.

[livinginfits.livejournal.com]

oh, he didn't mean homosexual ladies. everyone knows that shouldn't be illegal. i mean, really... he's attracted to the ladies... and also probably believes that everyone should be legally obliged to behave as he does. that means that he understands ladies lovin' ladies... unless they're lovin' on fatties or uglies. that's still illegal. it's certainly got to be in the bible.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

It clearly mentions "no fatties" in the Bible. Right there in Leviticus. "Do not lie with fatties, it is an abomination."

[eight.livejournal.com]

We're good people. It's always sad to see the love of two people of the same gender get categorized with pedophilia - especially when the view is held by someone (or a lot of someones) with enough understanding to go look at statistics and definitions that prove otherwise in black and white.

My friend told me on the news two days ago, in light of Brokeback and Transamerica and Capote winning Golden Globes, one station reported that the Golden Globes obviously had 'a hidden agenda' this year. So, so sad. : (

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

There have been a number of queer-themed movies in the Oscar run this year... not that there haven't been others (Quills? Philadelphia?) but I don't know if there's been another year when there have been so many running at the same time. (Not that I mind...)

I always wonder what, exactly, the "gay agenda" is. I always wanted to stick a bunch of planner notebook pages all over myself for Halloween one year and go as "the gay agenda."

hahaha

[eight.livejournal.com]

Jude, you're the shit. That would be the BEST Halloween costume .ever.

Re: hahaha

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

The other year I was an "identity thief." I brought a bunch of "Hello, My Name Is..." labels to a party, made people put their names on them, and I stole them and stuck them to myself.

I am the queen of the $2 costume.

[michael622.livejournal.com]

I was just telling Sherri (my sis-in-law) last night that I just can't wrap my mind around the concept that other people's sex lives have anything AT ALL to do with me and are my business in ANY way. I just don't get why people feel they have the RIGHT to tell anybody else how they can live their life.

Honestly, it boggles my poor little mind.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Me too, my friend. Me too.

[dch4.livejournal.com]

You know, I really need to take the time to read more of the other articles (as I've been bad about that of late). I can make a good guess at whose article it was, and I'm honestly a little stunned by that being said. Obviously I don't believe anything like that, and I honestly wouldn't have pegged that poster to believe it should be criminalized.

I'm just stunned right now. I think that's the only way to describe it.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Stunned is pretty much how I felt, too. I couldn't even believe it.

Aah well, what can you do?

Oh. My. God. (sorry so long, this is something I feel strongly about)

[amyura.livejournal.com]

Um, what the fuck?

First of all, I'm a Christian and I've read the Bible several times cover to cover. There are a grand total of two verses in the entire book that even mention homosexuality. Two. And there are as many verses stating that heterosexual relationships are wrong as well! I'm a firm believer in the consequences of sin being manifest in natural law, and there's just no evidence in natural law that a loving, commited, monogamous relationship between two consenting adults, regardless of the gender of either partner, is wrong. On the contrary, many higher species have at least some degree of homosexuality in their relationships. I care a lot about morality and being a good person, and in my world view, part of being a good person means refraining from judging the personal relationship of two other people. I'd be more concerned about an abusive relationship, hetero or homo, than about the sex of partners in a healthy relationship.

Second, even if homosexual sex were a sin, the Bible also says the gossip, drunkenness, and adultery are sins. I don't see anyone on the religious right trying to make any of those illegal. Laws should be restricted to infringement of other people's rights. So it shouldn't be illegal to get drunk, but when that drunkenness endangers others, for example if the drinker is behind the wheel of a car, then that is what should be, and thankfully is, illegal. Same-sex marriage, though, doesn't hurt anyone. I was legally married before you and Jen were. Your marriage has not made mine weaker (my husband's antiquated ideas regarding sex roles and baby care have, but that's an issue for my own journal, not yours!). If anything, opening marriage up to more people strengthens the institution of marriage, not weakens it!

Third, the argument that marriage has always been between one man and one woman is especially rich coming from religious conservatives, given how many patriarchs in the Bible had more than one wife, and is laughable when Romney says it, given his membership in a church that encouraged polygamy until political reasons (Utah's statehood) got too compelling to keep it as a practice.

Fourth, equating same-sex marriage with murder and pedophilia can be dismissed with one word: consent. Even if one did believe that homosexual sex were the worst sin that someone could commit, the partners in a same-sex marriage are consenting adults. If children aren't having sex, it's not pedophilia. If nobody is killed, it's not murder. What an idiot to bring those two crimes into the argument in the first place.

It just really bothers me that same-sex marriage is even an issue. It just shouldn't be. Two adults want to get married, they should just be able to go to the town hall and get a marriage license, end of story.

Re: Oh. My. God. (sorry so long, this is something I feel strongly about)

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I'm right there with you, my friend. 100%.

How other people can get so worked up about relationships between /strangers/ is just so beyond me.

p.s. Don't worry about the length - you can preach in my LJ any old day. :) Heck, I've posted longwinded in yours too, I'm sure.

[rizzo41.livejournal.com]

As much as I agree with you about your actual post I have to ask you about Law & Order... Were you watching the Wed 10PM regular tv episode about the guy drowned in the bath tub? And if so, WHO was the chick that played the girlfriend? I so know her from somewhere and I can't place her and it's driving me mad. MAD, I say!

[rizzo41.livejournal.com]

Nevermind. I figured it out. She was the bitchy teacher on Boston Public.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I'm glad you figured it out, because a) I wasn't paying very good attention to SVU the other night, and b) I never watched Boston Public.

[rizzo41.livejournal.com]

Boston Public was a really good show. FOX got all kinds of stupid when they moved it from a really sweet time slot to like, 9pm on Friday and the show just fizzled and died. You should netflix it. I think you might like it.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Maybe I will. (But I already have like 70 DVDs on my list.)

[rizzo41.livejournal.com]

70?! Baby, I have 300.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

When my queue gets over 70, I get incredibly anxious. I don't watch them fast enough - as it is, I'm getting movies I probably picked a year ago.

[rizzo41.livejournal.com]

Anxious? Whatever for? It's not like an assignment or something..

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Because I know I'll never get around to watching all of those movies!

We're watching maybe 5 discs/month right now.

[rizzo41.livejournal.com]

I'd watch more if the mail wasn't so ungodly slow here...

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

We get our stuff in like a day. And then it sits in the apartment for about 2 weeks.

Sometimes I start to feel bad for having them so long and I put them on for background noise. I should do that right now with my Margaret Cho disc!

[rizzo41.livejournal.com]

In NYC I generally got a new movie 2 days after I sent one in. Here it seems to take 3 days for them to get the movie, then I get another one the next day. It's getting annoying.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Ugh, that totally sucks. I remember when there weren't many distribution centers and it took forever. Now I usually get a movie 2 days after I stick it in the mail - one day to get to them and one to get it back to me. It's nice.

It would probably be faster if I dropped off the movies at the post office instead of waiting for the mail carrier to pick it up from my job. But hey, I'm lazy.

[rizzo41.livejournal.com]

Oddly enough I've noticed that it takes way longer for them to get it if I mail it from the post office than if I leave it in my mailbox for the carrier to take. I'll have to experiment with walking it down to the mailbox on the corner to see if that makes any difference.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

The science of mail!

[serenity-coach7.livejournal.com]

That makes me sad too. =(

I have to admit I have NO understanding how someone could admit (and more disurbingly believe) that two consenting adults who love each other are wrong (or EEEEK.....criminals????) because of that relationship!!

Isn't there enough negativity in this world for people to try to overcome without worrying about what other people do in their own lives???

Sorry your heart is broken hunny....you KNOW you are a great person who does wonderful work, and is a gift to Jen and every other life you touch every day!!

Gentle Hugs ~ J

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I realize that "sin is sin" and that when it comes to sin, all sins are bad and yadda yadda. But I can't wrap my mind around the idea that there's no element of "consent" when it comes to comparisons. Murder and rape... as serious as gayness or lying or disrespecting your mom? Really? And heck, when you look at the whole list, only queerness pops up in the "doesn't hurt other people" category.

I wish other people in the world would try to avoid negativity. Wouldn't that be nice.

[kat-chan.livejournal.com]

If this person thinks homosexuality should be criminalized, I wonder what he'd think of people who are not normatively-gendered. Nothing good, I'm sure.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Yeah, somehow I don't think I'll ask him.

I haven't had any good conversations about gender in a long time. I miss you.

[kat-chan.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I miss you, too. You're one of the few people that I could have open conversations about gender with. Talk to most straight, never-questioned-their-gender people, and they don't get the idea of non-normative gendering. Talk to most of the trans community, and they're so dead-set on people taking their non-normative gender seriously that they slot themselves into a camp in the binary system, and build a rhetorical and psychological bunker around themselves, so much to the point that they can't talk about non-normative gender without being just as awful and "gender-straight" as the non-trans folk. I have a few people I can talk to, but our conversations are about 10% of the conversations I have about gender, I swear.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I never have any conversations about gender anymore. :( I have a couple of friends with non-normative gender but they are all so busy, we don't get a lot of chats in. And heck, I don't even feel like *I* have non-normative gender anymore.

SAD! :(

[stapynam.livejournal.com]

i think the guy that wrote that is gay, and can't deal. he reminds me of the neighbor on American Beauty.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I don't think he is (although I don't know him well). However, I often wonder about people who are so "morally rigid." I want to know more about them, you know? I want to know how they became so "superior."