Ninth Topic: Religion

[judecorp]

I'd like to know more about your religious leanings. I believe you've mentioned the UCC church, which (if I'm remembering correctly) is the one open to everyone from atheists to hardcore jesus-freaks. Where do you fall on the spectrum.

Are your beliefs and Jen's beliefs fairly well aligned? If not, how do you work around that?

I was raised Roman Catholic. All my life, with 13 years of Catholic school to boot. And you know what? I loved it. I was really into it. I sang in the children's choir. Did liturgical dances with other girls in my class. Played sports through CYO (Catholic Youth Organization). Taught religious education. Was the youth member of the parish council. Was a peer minister in high school. Did a bazillion service projects. I had big church love.

And there were a lot of things the Catholic Church and I didn't agree on. And while there are certainly a large number of Catholics who believe in a sort of "Catholic Buffet" where you pick and choose what things you want to believe in and follow, I had too much respect for the Catholic Church to do that. I really think that if you are going to be a member of a church or religion, you really should be able to stand by everything they say. So I left.

From there I spent a little time exploring my pagan side. I enjoyed writing and doing rituals and liked the philosophical stuff behind it all, but I had a heck of a time finding community, because I couldn't really find a group of pagans that wanted to be more pro-pagan than anti-christian. So I went to the Unitarian Universalists, because they'll take anyone. I belonged to a great UU church in Bangor, Maine and then an okay church in Columbus, Ohio. And when Jen and I moved back to Massachusetts I conned her into going to some services with me. But we didn't really find a congregation in the Boston area that we really clicked with. So we occasionally went to the church in Quincy, or sometimes to Arlington Street. I wasn't really feeling the UU stuff as much but I love their youth program.

When we came here to Western MA, we again looked for a UU church to join. And again we just didn't mesh with the people. Most of the congregations were older, not terribly approachable. We went to one church many times and people didn't really talk to us. I wanted to switch churches but as Jen always told me she wasn't Christian, I didn't really know where we could both go. But later she said that she felt like UU sermons were like sitting in a comparative religion or philosophy class instead of church and was amenable to looking around.

I was really interested in the United Church of Christ because they have a strong social justice component (which I love about the UUs) and they do the Jesus thing without using Jesus to put people down, or persecute people, or whatever. They really seem to get to the heart of what Jesus was (at least to me) and have a kind of Jesus I can really get into, the kind of Jesus I really loved when I was a child. And that's what I want for my child(ren), you know? That "Jesus loves me" feeling, that idea of Christianity that is all about helping others and lifting people up and promoting peace. So I finally convinced Jen that we should check out this one particular church, and she agreed.

And I went into labor the night before. Oops. So that got put on hold.

We eventually went when Punk was about 3 months old, and as soon as we walked in, people TALKED to us. One couple came right up to us when we weren't sure what to do (we had intended to bring Punk into the service but someone trying to be helpful told us to bring her to the child care area which we were sooo not cool with) and just started talking about what they did with their daughter when she was a baby, etc. Just really welcoming. And there were young couples there, and young families, and LOTS of kids. It was just a real "Aha" moment for me, and I knew right away that it was the place for me.

I was concerned that Jen wouldn't want to go again because of the Jesus factor, but I think she realized how much I really wanted the Jesus factor and she did agree that it felt more like church than the UUs, and she wanted a church family to raise our daughter in. So we joined, and Punk will be baptized this spring. I don't know if Jen is as into it as I am (she was raised Catholic; her mom is Catholic and her dad is Jewish) but I think she is as committed to bring faith to our kids.

Yay!

But as for the spectrum... I consider myself a big fan of Jesus and Christlike living. I don't mean being a fundamentalist Bible-thumper, or in any kind of hellfire and brimstone kind of way. I mean living like Christ. I think he was the ultimate social worker.

Comments

[ladygreyy.livejournal.com]

I think he was the ultimate social worker.

That's so true!

[dustyskinandall.livejournal.com]

My opinion about Jesus is a lot like yours. I grew up Catholic too and always admired the monks I knew at a monastery near here because they struck me as being *Christlike* in their daily lives. My Godmother is also a good example of this... and that's why I can sort of shrug off "Crazy Christians". I know there are really wonderful Christians truly living like Jesus, or trying as hard as they can to, instead of spending all their time judging others.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Yeah. I try not to let the "Christians" get in the way of my enjoying Christianity. It's hard, because my knee-jerk reaction is just to run far, far away.. when that doesn't really help me at all.

[saldemonium.livejournal.com]

I think he was the ultimate social worker.

I /love/ that. =)

I consider myself a big fan of Jesus and Christlike living. I don't mean being a fundamentalist Bible-thumper, or in any kind of hellfire and brimstone kind of way. I mean living like Christ.

This fits right in with what I believe, too. It's what we try to teach our children, and I think it gives them something important to know that Jesus loves them, unconditionally. =)

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I really like the unconditional love aspect, too. Especially for kids. I am such a sucker for that "Jesus loves me, this I know," stuff. :)

[thatpatti.livejournal.com]

I consider myself a big fan of Jesus and Christlike living. I don't mean being a fundamentalist Bible-thumper, or in any kind of hellfire and brimstone kind of way. I mean living like Christ. I think he was the ultimate social worker.

amen, sista!

[sillypilgrim.livejournal.com]

I was just going to comment about your last paragraph but everyone else said what I was going to say :)

[sassywoman.livejournal.com]

And there were a lot of things the Catholic Church and I didn't agree on. And while there are certainly a large number of Catholics who believe in a sort of "Catholic Buffet" where you pick and choose what things you want to believe in and follow, I had too much respect for the Catholic Church to do that. I really think that if you are going to be a member of a church or religion, you really should be able to stand by everything they say. So I left.

I really identified with your statement about the "Catholic Buffet". I that conversation with my Mom when I left the Church and she respected me for leaving vs. staying and picking and choosing what to believe.

I think he was the ultimate social worker.

AGREE 100%

[changinglight.livejournal.com]

I mean living like Christ. I think he was the ultimate social worker.

I am so stealing this line from you. (credited, of course.)

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Sure thing, baby.

[oppendonnell.livejournal.com]

We had a similar experience (with different results). C. was raised Catholic (Catholic school all the way through high school) and she feels the same way you do about the Catholic buffet -- so she, too, left. We tried UU and it just didn't feel right. The congregation near us felt very Protestant, which of course is UU's origin, and that ended up feeling alien to both of us.
So we went with the Jews because through me we have that available. And we feel like that will give J. what we liked about growing up with a strong sense of religion, which was really important for both of us.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I have gone to really protestant UUs, really hippie UUs, and some in between. I have noticed that the older the congregation (meaning, the age of the members), the more protestant they seem to lean. Have you noticed this?

[oppendonnell.livejournal.com]

Yes, absolutely; we talked about the fact that a different congregation might suit us better. However, the one we disliked was nice and close to our house, and we just weren't committed enough to UU to shlep all over the place. Oh, well. Jew it is. ;-)

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Bring on the Jews!

Unwelcoming Welcoming Congregations. . .

[robinedgar.livejournal.com]

Am I correct in understanding that you and Jen found yourselves to be rather less than genuinely welcome in some Unitarian*Universalist Welcoming Congregations? Be assured that you are not alone in experiencing just how unwelcoming U*U Welcoming Congregations (http://emersonavenger.blogspot.com/2008/03/wheres-welcoming-in-welcoming.html) can be.

Re: Unwelcoming Welcoming Congregations. . .

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

To be precise, they weren't unwelcoming, and it wasn't queer-related. They just weren't friendly folks and didn't really go out of their way to bring in the "new people." We live in a very queer area and I really don't get any anti-queer vibes around here.

[hope-persists.livejournal.com]

I've heard UCC referred to as "Unitarians Considering Christ." It makes me giggle.

I'm a jew and yet I'm totally in love with the UCC congregation at the church i work at. It seems like a really rad group of folks in the UCC world.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I have heard that too. It's funny.

I have heard good things about that congregation. I love that it's right down the street from my UCC congregation. :)

[vorpalbla.livejournal.com]

"I really think that if you are going to be a member of a church or religion, you really should be able to stand by everything they say. So I left."

I have to ask, because you know how I am: Do you stand by everything Christianity (a la UCC) says? Everything Jesus said? (e.g., no one can be Saved except through Him) Or do you order the buffet?

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Well, I don't believe we really know exactly what Jesus said. I don't believe the Bible is some sort of infallible word of God or whatever. I believe in the idea of Jesus, and I believe that he was a kind, caring, compassionate person who believed in the intrinsic worth of all people, wanted justice for all people, etc. I can totally stand behind that 100%.

Do I believe that Christianity is the only way to "salvation"? Depends what "salvation" really means, you know? Do I think there is an afterlife that is only accessible to Christians? No. And I don't think Jesus would think so either.