A few odds and ends:

[judecorp]

I know that Punk is a special and unique snowflake and all of that. I do. And I know that it doesn't matter how many people are created by her sperm donor, she will still be special. That's not really the issue. I just do a lot of reading about donor conceived people and the angst they feel later on in life. Granted, a lot of these DC folks are adults and/or young adults now and a lot of them found out about their DC origins later in life and/or were lied to, but I still worry. I mean, you just never know.

We used an anonymous donor who is not willing to be identity-released. At the time, we thought that was the best decision for our family. It was very important to Jen to do things this way, and as she was the "non-bio mom" and therefore had enough stressors about things, I felt that her feelings should be respected on this issue. Originally I wanted a known donor, and I still tend to think I prefer that, but it is what it is. I just wish I could get reliable genetic information for Punk when/if she ever needs it, you know?

Forty families is a lot. It doesn't mean 40 children. It means they say they will give the sperm to 40 different families. Families can buy as many vials as they want and have as many children as they want. And families can always sell/give sperm to other families. And who knows how accurately they really stick to the 40. Most banks say 10 families or 10 families with reported pregnancies. And it's been estimated that only 40% report. (We did, but waaaaaay later. You know, you get busy.) There are already 20 reported births with this particular donor. 20! Many are in Canada because Xytex is one of the few banks that meets Canadian regs.

I am thankful to our donor because I am eternally grateful for Punk. She is the most awesome ever and now knows how to stack two blocks together which is so awesome awesome and makes the EI mama happy. And I want her to be aware of her half-sibs and her origins and all of that, and I do believe in the end she will be happy and glad she was born into our family... but I do worry that she thinks it's unfair that she doesn't really know about half of her genetic material.

~//~

We took Punk to Friendly's last night for a quickie night out. We ordered her a dinner of her own (mac and cheese and hot dogs, not the best ever but we ordered her some broccoli, too) which came with a drink and a little sundae. I ordered her some strawberry ice cream with strawberry sauce. She. Loved. It. She only had a couple of bites (I ate the rest, burp) but she was jonesing for it BIG TIME. She actually busted out the 'more' sign which she never ever ever uses.

I guess "Ice Cream Junkie" is a genetic trait. She must have gotten that along with my blue eyes. :)

Comments

[lizardjee.livejournal.com]

we kind of worry about the same thing with jaxen, but he was suppose to have jaeci to make it better.. that did not work out so we are just going to always be honest with him and he will know that we did what we did because we wanted him so much, and he was loved so much we are hoping to skip the angst.. or at least soften it.
i think jeani and my family of origin is so non traditional that jaxen will just accept it as the norm.
(but then again.. living through the tween years with mia, who is 11 and in hysterics and wanting to never leave her room again all over a pimple, i am not sure how well this theory will work out)

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

See, that's what I'm talking about. I think in the long run it will be okay, I really do or I wouldn't have done it... but I worry about the tween and teen drama and what donor sperm could play in that.

[wendywoowho.livejournal.com]

When I was 16, I got a letter from my father's father, who had abandoned the family when my dad was 3 years old. One of the statements in the letter: "I have 20 children that I know about."

....yeah.

So, Daddy went off to grad school, in another state, and found someone his age, with his name, and his face. Turns out, his half brother. With his same name. With his same face.

Knowing your genetic source is no sure buffer against this kind of angst, it turns out.

I think yer Punk needs a tee that says "Ice Cream Junkie."

[mayna.livejournal.com]

wow, that's pretty crazy. I can't imagine what that would be like, meeting someone who looks like you AND has the same name...

[jadefu.livejournal.com]

There was an Oprah show earlier this year about kids from donor sperm, now that it's been going on long enough that the earliest ones are becoming adults. So you're not the only one thinking about this stuff.

I looked up the link for you so you could see it:
http://www.oprah.com/slideshow/oprahshow/slideshow1_ss_rel_20080208/1

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I saw the show. It ran twice, actually, and got a lot of buzz on one of the mailing lists I am on. That's where I originally realized that some donor conceived people are really, really upset. It honestly (naively?) had never occurred to me.

Thanks for the link. Hopefully someone else will want to watch the show! :)

[sudrin.livejournal.com]

While I'm sure there will be angst, I don't imagine it will be soul crushing or anything. Lets face it, everyone has angst about something. Having been someone who never knew his father, I'm sure its something she will have to cope with at some point. While I'm sure you'd "Fix" that if you could I really think the love you both show her will pretty much trump the "angst".

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I know that you didn't know your father and thus you have a unique perspective on this. But you did know his name, and you have photographs, and you may/may not have access to his family (I'm not sure about this part) so in that sense you do have more than my kid will. You have an identity for your father, even though you didn't know him. It doesn't make the not knowing easier, but it is something.

[oppendonnell.livejournal.com]

I think about this too, of course. We're all just gonna have to do the best we can. At least our kids will know each other so they can bitch to each other.

I am insanely curious about J's half-siblings but no one's on the DSR or registered with our sperm bank's version of the DSR. Frustrating.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I keep telling myself that the IVP: Next Generation can all have big angst-filled meetups when we all get together when we're really old. :)

[fleur.livejournal.com]

My cousin's kids' donor was in the semi-available category; if the kids want to know his name that's fine but he's not going to be "dad" and he will not go looking for any of them. She has found out who he is through on-line message boards of other women who had donors, and in particular this one; she's part of the whole online community of all the half sibs and their moms.

I can understand why you would be insanely curious to know who he is, especially as the kids get older.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

There are some anonymous donors, even, who have come out of anonymity and registered online or on message boards. That's pretty exciting but I doubt that most donors will do that. Cool about your cousin's kids.

I think in the end things will be fine, and I think reaching out to other families who used our donor will help in some respects because there will at least be 'family' on that side, you know?

[folkyboy.livejournal.com]

aww she's getting so big! and we're getting so old...

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Dude, I know.

[estrange.livejournal.com]

I didn't even know there was an option to know who the donor was

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

There is. Some banks offer some of their sperm as "identity-release," meaning that the children can access some information about the donor when they are 18, and in some cases may even contact the donor. Not a lot of donors agree to this, though, and the sperm is also sold at increased cost, which I think is really bogus.

[sassywoman.livejournal.com]

Just wanted to let you know I think you're smart for thinking through the possible emotions August may experience.
You know ... we might have to make a decision about adopting our embryos out someday including the terms of adoption. It's hard for me to think about letting Emma's or another siblings full-blooded brother/sisters out to another family but we cannot have more then three children from a financial perspective. I will have to figure out how I want all of that work out too. *hugs*

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I certainly can't speak to your anguish re: embryo adoption AT ALL. But I will tell you that there is a woman on one of my message boards (for babies born in the summer of 2007) and her baby was from an embryo adoption. She and her DH adopted (I think) 3 or 4 embryos and they have a few on ice and are gearing up for an FET. I can't imagine how hard it would be to donate embryos, but I also hear this woman talk about how thankful she is for the gift she received, and how thankful she is for her daughter, and oh my gosh, it is amazing that she was able to have this experience, you know? Amazing.

You send those embryos to me and I'll FET Emma's half siblings! Yeah!

[ladyleo.livejournal.com]

As long as she has your support, I think she will handle things. In some ways, it is a lot like a closed adoption. Also, you should be able to get health info without identifiers from the SB, yes? (please correct me if I am wrong, since you know, I sleep with my donor ;-) )

And I miss Friendly's! I am now craving a Reese's PB sundae with no hot fusge and double marshmellow :P

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I do trust that she will work out her feelings and come to some sort of peace with her conception. I do. I don't know how hard it will be to come to that peace, and I know it's largely an individual thing, so you just don't know what will happen until it happens. I will just be there and try to be as understanding as I can.

Now come up here so we can take you to Friendly's! A pregnant girl's gotta have Friendly's!

[tea-soaked.livejournal.com]

i think about the donor stuff too... i wonder how carys will feel. her donor is id release.

this is one of the reasons why i want c to meet other kids conceived the way she was conceived... you know?

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I am curious to see (in the future) if kids from ID-release donors have a different experience than non-ID-release, and if so, how much difference. I guess it will be a good thing that A and C will be BFF because we can find out first hand!

I definitely would like to meet some half-sibs. Right now the one I know is in BC.

[stapynam.livejournal.com]

these are a lot of the same issues we deal with on the adoption front. it's why we chose an open adoption.

i think it will really help punk that you are sensitive to the notion that she feels the loss of half of her bio family. not that she doesn't/won't want to be in her own family, it's just a loss that will need to be acknowledged. it's most frustrating when people disregard kids' need to know about (or just plain curiosity) where they came from. it's not a rejection of their new family, it's just a human need. some kids have it stronger than others. i would say just let it be an open dialogue and you'll learn where punk falls on the spectrum as far as her individual need to know/ask about her other side.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Yeah, definite similarities on the adoption front. For sure.

I really do try to imagine her situation and how she might see her situation in the future. In the end I know that she will have her own feelings about the situation and they might not all be positive, no matter how positively I brought her into this world and how much she was wanted. And I really do want to honor and respect that as much as I can and from the very first minute.

I do disagree with people who call donors 'fathers' because I really do think there is some sort of extra step that goes into making a father, but regardless, her donor is half of her genetic material and therefore a HUGE part of her life no matter what.

[ladygreyy.livejournal.com]

Regardless of anything, Punk couldn't ask for a more doting mama than you!

Funny, Kendra had her first taste of strawberries last night! Was NOT impressed, oddly enough!

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

It's true, I'm her #1 sucker for sure!!

August LOVES strawberries. Loves. Actually, she loves all fruit except avocado. She's 'eh' on that.

[twomomsarebetterthanone.wordpress.com (from livejournal.com)]

i think all we can do is be open and honest. one set of Mr.E's 1/2 siblings are old enough to talk about their donor and they do. it's been encouraged by their moms - as soon as they started asking questions, the moms started listening and answering. they are amazingly well adjusted 7 and almost 13 year olds.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

It's true - honesty and open communication, along with empathy, are the only tools we really have. Your donor is ID-release and that adds an extra piece. Our donor? Well, he's anonymous... and prolific. ;)

[quezz.livejournal.com]

I struggle with this issue as I consider a donor situation for myself in a few years. I don't have the world's closest relationship with my family, and I worry that on some level, I'm creating distance by leaving a father out of the equation. At the very least, I'd want a genetic history for my child...but I'm beginning to wonder if a personal history is just as important. In your case...Punk has one -- she has two parents that love and take care of her, and she will in the end have a personal history with a loving family. I think that is a great thing, and I'm sure she might even be tickled by having so many half-siblings.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I have a piece of paper with some basic information but you just never know how much of it is true, especially the health history. So there's that.

I /do/ come from a very close family and I am confident in the idea that my child will have SOME roots. And Jen has family as well, though we are not as close with them, and I think having any family around fills some of that void. And then there is family of choice... it's not like you're living in a vacuum.

I think you're right that personal history is important. I also know that donors are important to people because regardless of their personal history, that person, the anonymous person, helped to create the person they are.

Anonymous donation is illegal in several other countries

[ml66uk.livejournal.com]

Anonymous donation is actually illegal in several countries now, including the UK, the Netherlands, Sweden, Norway, Iceland, Finland, Switzerland, Austria, and New Zealand.

Artificial insemination isn't new btw. The first reported case was in the 19th century, and there are several donor-conceived people in their 50's and 60's who post on the Internet regularly.

Re: Anonymous donation is illegal in several other countries

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I never claimed that AI was new. I claimed that TELLING people they were donor conceived is somewhat new - up until very recently, most parents were actually counseled not to tell ever. *shrug*

And yes, it's true that anonymous donation is making itself scarce in other parts of the world. I think that is fantastic and should be the way it goes.

[mayna.livejournal.com]

Well, then there are all the kids adopted from foreign countries, with a slim to none chance of knowing who their bio-parents are, and I don't think they're too angsty about it (my sister's boyfriend was adopted from Korea). I think if someone grows up from a young age knowing how they were conceived, that it's not shocking and life-altering (not that I have a lot of experience, but that's my take...)

[bookgrrrl.livejournal.com]

I'm angsty about this also. Our guy is ID-consent, and one of the reported pregnancies has been tagged as being on the Autism spectrum. Because of this, they've pulled him as a donor, but I think when we try again, we'll still use him (for lots of reasons), but I will admit that one of them is that I'm kinda relieved that it should limit the number of kids.

[theshapeshifter.livejournal.com]

As others have said, I think the sheer fact that you're thinking about this now and considering Punk's possible emotional responses to it, will go a long way towards making the whole deal as low-angst as possible. I've known a lot of adopted people over the years, and it seems like the only ones who had major angst about it have been the ones who only found out at an older age and had it come as a shock, kwim?

And big woot for ice cream! They were giving out samples of rainbow sherbet at the grocery store the other day and Duncan was all over that like a mad fiend.

[katishna.livejournal.com]

If it makes you feel any better at all, my bio-dad is practically a sperm donor. I have no information about him other than a picture and some really old information about where he was at the time of my birth, so I have no biological information about him whatsoever other than what differs from my mom's side. It's ok, really. It would be nice to know how many women in his family had breast cancer and all that, but on the other hand it's kind of nice not to have the burden of knowledge.

[drainbead.livejournal.com]

I don't know about half my genetic material either, and I was conceived the old-fashioned way--on the hood of a car during the 4th of July fireworks show in 1977. ;-)

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

D'OH!!!!

[kat-chan.livejournal.com]

Just for a little perspective, I don't know about half of my genetic material because my mom was adopted as a child. Well, I know a little about it, because I know that my mom had breast cancer. But there are other things; heart disease risk, elevated risk of other cancers, and so on. My mom and I will talk about how it would be interesting to trace her biological parents' families for the family tree, but really the only strong desire to know about her parents is the desire to know the medical history, that way we don't have that gap. My mom says that it can be frustrating every time she goes to a new doctor, and they ask for medical history, and she can't give a family history because she's the only family history.

I know you worry about Gus and how she'll deal with these issues as she gets older. I just wanted to let you know that there are those of us out here to deal with the same issues. I hope that she will be as understanding about it as can be. I know that I sure can't blame my mom for being adopted or my grandparents for adopting her. But there's nothing weirder than turning in a family history and "mother's family" is almost completely blank, and the doctor stares at you like you have two heads while you explain that you mother is adopted so you don't know anything beyond her history. And that really is the problem of the people I have to deal with, not a problem on my mom's part.

I hope that what I'm saying makes some sort of sense. I'm not sure it does. And I really am trying to be reassuring.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Aaah, I knew I could count on you to explore the MAD SCIENCE!!

[colleenod.livejournal.com]

I definitely worry about it J. resenting us because we didn't use a known donor and he has to wait until he is 18 for info about his donor... or resenting us because he is a boy who doesn't have a father... etc. etc.

But, then I think, hey if any of those are the main things he resents us for, that means we didn't do anything even worse for him to resent us for. So, that's not so bad.

I think all we can be is honest. Yes, this isn't ideal in many ways. There may be things you miss or that you wish you had that you can never have. But, we love you and will try to meet your needs as best we can.

Actually, having been partially raised by a single dad because of my mom's death, not because of a choice, I have to say that those of us who go into situations knowingly -- not having it thrust upon us because of a trauma -- might actually do a better job of helping fill in the gaps for the kid. My dad didn't make any effort to provide me with a mother figure of any kind or to acknowledge that it might be hard to be a girl entering puberty with no mom. But I feel like gay dads with daughters probably will, because they went into that situation with their eyes open and without the baggage of "But I lost my spouse and I can't deal" that my dad had. So, hopefully, if we're aware that our kids might have issues with this, we will be able to make them feel loved and understood and to be open and listen to them. That's no small thing.

[vorpalbla.livejournal.com]

"I just wish I could get reliable genetic information for Punk when/if she ever needs it, you know?"

Why can't they give you all of the pertinent information other than the dude's name?

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I have a profile but there's really no way to know if the medical information is accurate. It's not like I can get PROOF of what he's got in his family, you know?