Where the boy at?

[judecorp]

One thing I noticed a bazillion years ago when I started getting involved in the genderqueer community was how many genderqueer people who were born female had been diagnosed with PCOS or other endocrine conditions. It's not really surprising, since PCOS raises androgen levels and throws off female hormones and all of that... but I'd never made that connection until I started hearing how many people had it. Treatment for PCOS used to just pretty much consist of birth control pills to regulate menstrual cycles, but that didn't really work for me. BCPs kind of turned me into a monster - I had these horrific mood swings and got really REALLY angry. Out of nowhere. I would be all happy-la-la and then I would just get totally pissed off. Or I would bust out crying because of some song on the radio. It was crazy. I was never so glad to ditch the BCPs. A. and I "risked" pregnancy for a long time because I refused to take BCPs anymore and wasn't really worried about getting pregnant, and life got much better.

The Metformin stuff seems to really be working, symptom-wise. I mean, I dropped a bunch of weight, I get my period every once in a while, and my insulin and testosterone levels have gone down into the normal range. But something has changed, something I haven't really been writing about but have definitely been thinking about.

I seem to be losing a lot of the boy in me, and that kind of bums me out. I'm guessing it's probably due to reduced androgen levels but I hate the idea that my identity and who I feel I am can be reduced to hormones. That's crazy! But it sure seems to be true.

It seems so strange to see older photos from when Jen and I got together. Now I have this froo-froo hair (which does look quite cool, I have to admit) and the lost weight means I don't fit into most of my boy pants anymore and I end up wearing these (very flattering) girly low-rise pants and stuff. It's crazy! So I have this girl hair and girl clothes and talk about baby-making and eeek, what happened to me?

I talk to my coworkers about passing as male a few years ago and no one believes me, and now I feel like I'm losing some of that genderqueer identity that I liked so much, that I felt so at home in. Only it doesn't feel very at home anymore. The idea that I have ever been a boy seems kind of like a sham. All this because of hormones?

This isn't very well developed or coherent, I know. It's just been on my mind. Thoughts?

Comments

[stapynam.livejournal.com]

"all this because of hormones?"
i think that's all it is for any of us, really. it's all it was in our development that differentiated males and females.
lately i have been thinking about Phases of Life. about how i am different than i was 3, 4, 8, ect years ago and wondering if i am being led astray from the Real Me... or if it is just a natural occurrence for the Real Me to be a little more fluid than i thought it would be. i'm sure what i am thinking about is not as substantial as what you are going through, but maybe it isn't so surprising (especially given the biochemical factor) that you are feeling different. i can see where it would be pretty unsettling though!

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Of course it's true that we all boil down to biology when you get down to the nitty gritty, but I just loathe the idea that we're ONLY biology. I mean, really, SO much happens to us in our lives besides division of cells and flowing of fluids... and I'd really like to think that THAT has more of an impact on my inner self. Then again, I could totally be wrong. :)

I think that the Real You changes over time. Changes don't make you stop being the Real You - instead, the Real You changes!

[snack.livejournal.com]

nodsnods i hear what you're saying

it does boil down to hormones i'm afraid. they're powerful little things. they can change HOW YOU THINK!

yeah. but it doesn't make you less you - just different than before. and if you think about it - you're different anyway because of a lot of other things.

so it kinda fits. ya know?

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

It's crazy that little cells and chemicals can change how we think, isn't it? I mean, come on... we have big brains and they are itty bitty chemicals! Sometimes it's so infuriating that I can't control my body with my head - it has to be the other way around. Craziness!

[jadefu.livejournal.com]

Actually, PCOS is present in at least 10% of females in the US according to the most recent research.... and they still suspect it's still undiagnosed. It's the #1 cause of infertility in women. I don't think it's a queer issue, it's a female issue, but it is an interesting coincidence.

So I have the usual pcos symptoms and have never been attracted to girls ever. Even with growing up in Northampton! :)

(btw, there are good and bad bcp's to take with pcos according to my endocrinologist.)

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I never mentioned sexual orientation here at all. I'm not saying that PCOS, or even MY PCOS, has any relevence whatsoever on whom I am attracted to, male or female. I was talking more about people in the genderqueer/transgender communities, which doesn't really take sexual orientation into account at all. Sorry for the confusion.

I'm more talking about gender identity, which I think IS strongly related to hormone breakdowns.

[jennbits.livejournal.com]

i know you're looking for thoughts about identity here, but all i can think of is wanting to see you in girly low rise pants :(

is that so wrong?

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Come visit and I'll wear them every day, JUST FOR YOU.

[estrange.livejournal.com]

I was wondering if many of the women who had PCOS were homosexual. I was thinking about that too - it does make sense since all hormone levels are out of whack from a regular woman. Sometimes I think I could go either way although I do lean more towards men.

I hate BCPs - they are evil. :/

I'm sorry you are losing some of the boy in you. It's all temporary anyway because after you get pregnant and have your little baby then you can get off the metformin if you want and go back to being who you were before - homone level wise anyway.

Part of it could just be that you are getting older & wiser too.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I don't know if there are more women with PCOS who are homosexual or bisexual or whatever. I suppose that's worth its own survey. I was more talking about gender identity ('genderqueer' being a term for people who may not identify as strictly male or female, but maybe somewhere in the middle of a perceived continuum of gender) and whether one's gender identity (do you feel like a boy? a girl? something in between?) can be manipulated by hormonal makeup.

I would definitely get off the metformin if I had a baby so I could breastfeed! But I would probably choose to get on a maintenance dose of it again later. I didn't like finding out that I had too much insulin in my body - that sounds like asking for trouble!

[luloubelle.livejournal.com]

I've been feeling a lot of what you wrote here, but haven't been able to really finger exactly what it was I was feeling... losing the boy, like you said, has a lot to do with it. I used to be a lot more comfortable than I am now... I feel like I'm faking it as a girl just because my hair has gotten longer, and my pants have gotten tighter. I like being right in the middle.

And I don't like that boys have suddenly started checking me out, and hitting on me. I don't know what to do!

I've always wondered what role me hormone levels play the way my brain seems to be wired. I feel so contradictory at times.

I also resemble the person you describe you are on BCPs, although I am not one them. I'm a walking mood swing. :)

Anyway, this post has given me lots to think about...

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

It's weird how appearance can shift our carriage and how we hold ourselves. I know I had a LOT more confidence when I was more boyish, less traditional. It's like all of a sudden I look more traditional and I inherit a lot of traditional "women's" baggage that I didn't have before. Oh well, it's probably all in my head.

It's just so funny that I've noticed a distinct trend since I started messing with my hormones. I've had high testosterone my whole life... and now I don't. I guess it shouldn't be surprising that it's made such a change, but sometimes you just don't think about things until they smack you in the face. You know?

Somehow, like everything else, I feel like you'll understand. You're the greatest sister I've never met.

p.s. I also feel like I'm faking it as a girl... but lately I've felt like if I tried to be a boy, I'd be faking at that, too.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_epiphany_girl_/]

That is so interesting. I have nothing interesting to add right now, except that I'm reading Middlesex right now and it's fascinating me with its discussion of gender and sex.

It makes sense to me that you would mourn for that part of you. And it's creepy that so much of who we are is based on chemicals we have no control over--sex hormones, specifically, but also, seratonin levels, depression/bipolar and other issues. It's who we are, but it can be tweaked by modern science. and that's exciting but also weird.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

It IS scary, in a lot of ways, that our minds, that sentient sense of self that we all (well, the nutty ones like us!) stew over and analyze and all of that, might not really be our own - but more just a collection of chemicals and the combination thereof. Doesn't that almost make us seem like less of individuals? I don't know... I mean, at least I still have a brain to overprocess all of this crap, right? ;)

It's not a mourning necessarily but it is a surprise. It's almost like I look at those pictures and think, "Who was that? Was that me? Is this me?" I guess the good thing is that I never really have to answer those questions.

[cappucinogrrl.livejournal.com]

Just because you're looking more traditionally womanly doesn't mean you can't still identify as genderqueer. I feel like genderqueer encompasses a ton of gender identities. I even consider myself slightly genderqueer.

I think you'll always have that boy in you, no matter what you look like.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Oh, I hear you. And I didn't mean to imply that I was any less genderqueer in my mind... just that my outward expression (which in some ways must come from inside my mind, right?) doesn't really reflect that right now... at least not to people that don't know me, you know? I mean, to most of the people I know recently (like work folks or whatever), I'm just the same old girl as everyone else, just Sally Social Worker Sunshine. It's WEIRD to me.

It's kind of like when I was married to A. and people had a perception of me as a young married woman that I was a fairly conservative straight girl... regardless of what I ever said. It's like I could get up on a mountain and scream, "No, really, I'm genderqueer, I'm serious!" and people would just giggle and hand me a skirt. ;)

[prunesnprisms.livejournal.com]

Can't really comment on feeling like a boy or not, but I will say that my hormones make me into a weepy Pruzilla, all the time. Which is part of why I'm on the three-month pills that we'll discover in ten years give me uterine cancer or something. If I went off them, I'd probably have to have a scrip for Prozac. Or at least Xanax.

Yeah. They make us do wild and crazy bad stuff.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Ugh, I /hope/ that they don't find that Seasonale causes more problems than regular BC pills. I don't think so, though, since lots of people take BCPs and just never take the placebos... and they all seem to be fine. Still, be careful!!

I don't like wild and crazy bad stuff. Make it stop!

[kieron.livejournal.com]

I have loved you throughout the evolutions that I have experienced. And I thought you were hot then and now. I am sorry that you feeling like you are losing something - part of who you identify as a whole. That has to be scary as well as hard. I feel for you, sweetheart. Look at it this way, you are strong and you are forthright and for some people that is manly enough! ;) In all seriousness, however, your hair and clothes are definitely on the rowr side AND you were also damned attractive when you could pass as a boy.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

You know what else is kind of tough? (And this isn't a criticism, so don't even go there.) I /know/, even though you make it very clear that you have always found me attractive, that you get more interested the girlier I look. And so it's such a mixed blessing - part of it feels like a costume party but at the same time, I like the results I get from you.

I guess life is like that - you try different suits on and hope that the one that fits is the one you like the most.

[thatpatti.livejournal.com]

i've always sort of wondered to myself if part of your gender identity might be related to these hormonal/fertility issues that you have. i wasn't sure if that was an appropriate thing to wonder (because, as you say, you hate to think that so much of yourself could be summed up in hormones!), so i find this interesting.

but like someone else said - we're all always changing. iv'e felt different since i had fisher. not just in the "i'm a mom" way, but i've noticed a distinct difference in the types of clothes i pick out and how i dress & present myself. i honestly think it has to do with some of the hormonal changes i had with pregnancy/nursing, etc.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Dude, if that's true, then I hope I have a baby - because seriously? You're all WOW now, Patti! REEEEEEE-OWWWW!

Seriously, though, you know you can always bring up anything at all and I would totally think about it and talk about it. But it IS interesting that so much can change in our BRAINS just based on neurotransmitters and hormones and other invisible things like that. I don't like thinking that I have NO CONTROL! ;)

[lickingtoad.livejournal.com]

If this means I'll start wearing tight clothes and adopting the mannerisms of Eurotrash when I turn 30 in an attempt to net someone who's 20, please. Shoot me.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I turned 30 recently. Am I missing something?

[hopemcg.livejournal.com]

I'm contemplating a lot of similar-ish stuff in the back of my mind, as well. I mean, I've always looked pretty girly, but now I'm knocked up. It doesn't really get much more girly. Oh, and clothes that are comfortable (ie maternity) are all pastel. I wear pink at least once a week. I know color is just color, but I have lost a little self-identity by wearing the clothing options available to me. Everybody wants to give me their chair or hold the door for me or whatever, so even my internal machismo is suffering. Not Megan though - she won't let me go soft. Smooches to her.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Everybody wants to give me their chair or hold the door for me or whatever, so even my internal machismo is suffering.

Exactly. I have WAY more "chivalry" incidents now that I have girlier hair and tighter clothes. It's kind of bizarre, and more than a little disheartening.

p.s. You with long hair, pastel clothing, and a big baby belly kind of freaks me out. My image of you in my mind will always be the short-haired Hope with the orange tshirts, geocaching accessories, and our matching glasses.

[kat-chan.livejournal.com]

Any thoughts I have would probably be better reserved for private e-mail. I've thought a lot about genderqueerness lately, myself, and I could probably write volumes about how I've felt about gender lately.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Feel free to e-mail me anytime: jude at judecorp dot com

[sunshyne72.livejournal.com]

Not to intentionally add fuel to the fire, but I deal with a lot of the hormone stuff/pcos and such, too. And I recently learned from some study somewhere that women with high testosterone levels can pass that off onto their daughters. This gives me great worries, not because I have fear of having a girl that is gay or questions her gender but because I want her to not have to deal with the whacked out hormones. I'd hate to pass this onto my child. I don't like my ups and downs and craziness that insulin, testosterone and estrogen unbalance brings. And I certainly don't want to pass on the diabetes (but that's somewhat inevitable). Anyway, throws ONE more wrench into the whole baby making scheme.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

In all honestly, I don't worry much at all about passing PCOS or hormone issues onto any kids I may or may not have. We /all/ have a grand mix of genetic material - some positive, some not as positive. I have so much GOOD genetic material to offer that I'm sure it more than balances out. Besides, I don't feel much like I'm hurting at all to have this PCOS/hormone stuff. Aside from that, I'm in pretty fantastic health and come from a line of people (my dad aside) who live a long time!

[skreeky]

What I am reminded of is the difference between my brother's reaction to an antidepressant drug, and mine.

How much of our personality depends on one little chemical and how much of it is there?

My brother went off the antidepressants, even though the rest of us found him way easier to deal with while he was on them. He said, "I don't feel like myself. I don't know who this is." He'd been depressed since he was in 5th grade, and had never gotten to know himself as a non-depressed adult. The depression - with a mainly chemical cause - was intrinsic to his identity. By changing the chemistry, he lost himself.

I, however, did spend a good portion of adult life free of dpression, and when it did hit, part of why it was so terrifying is that I didn't know myself anymore and I didn't understand why I did the things I did. When I started taking drugs to bring my balance back, my reaction was "Oh! Yes, I remember feeling like this. This is me. Here I am."

Nearly as I can tell, it's *all* just chemicals.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I suppose it is largely chemicals, but I don't feel comfortable thinking that it's ALL chemicals. I think human thought is a powerful, powerful tool. I really think we can think ourselves into almost anything. Or maybe I'm just fooling myself with my chemicals. ;)

But yeah - chemicals definitely play a huge part, huger than I'm comfortable, but hey, that's life.

[calledmara.livejournal.com]

genderqueer? Oh, Jude, you're so trendy. Don't forget to spell "boy" as "boi" and you'll be good to go.

;)

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Oh, hush. I hate "boi."

=P