So tell me about the guy...

[judecorp]

So what IS behind all the curiosity of who our donor is? No less than 12 people have asked me questions inquiring about the guy, what he looks like, etc. I'm not really sure what to make of it all. Part of me thinks maybe people are just being curious and asking questions (and maybe I would do the same thing) and the other part of me gets kind of weirded out.

I mean, as far as I'm concerned, there's no GUY involved. There were a bunch of .pdf profiles that we looked at to check health records, hair/eye color, etc. There's an encrypted number and I called the bank, I inquired about availability of the number, and I arranged an order. There's no name, no face, no personality profile, no favorite song. It's not a real person. It's a couple of tiny vials of stuff that my wife and I hope to use to make a baby. Our baby.

I guess it's sort of natural curiosity to want to know more details, but the part of me that is weirded out is the part that's incredibly protective of Jen. This is HER potential child, and anything that leaves her out, even a little bit, obviously raises my hackles. I dread the day when we're actually pregnant and the question changes from, "Who's the guy?" to "Who's the father?" I can't decide if I'll answer with, "Jen" or with something snarkier.

If we were using a known donor, perhaps there could be more talk about the guy. ("A friend," I could say, or, "This acquaintance of mine.") But it's not even like that. Jen felt much more comfortable using a totally anonymous bunch of words in a bank, and so we're paying the hefty price to have that anonymity, to /not/ have the presence of a guy, you know? There's just me and Jen. And hopefully a baby.

And what about this guy, right? Well, as far as I'm concerned, as long as he's healthy and his sperm is viable, who cares? He doesn't matter to me in the slightest. It's just a fertility treatment expense, just like the meds will be, just like the IUIs will be. There's nothing to tell.

~//~

So, to be fair, those of you who have ever thought about asking "about the guy," let me hear your side (if you want). What brought about the question? Why would you want to know? What would you be hoping to hear? Inquiring minds want to know.

Comments

[thatpatti.livejournal.com]

well, you posted about how you guys had been looking over profiles and trying to decide on a donor. i guess maybe i'd be curious about what it was that made you decide on the one you did.

so, in a sense, i'm asking "who's the guy?" not because i care about the GUY, but because i'm curious about what made you decide that this guy's sperm would help make a good baby!

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Well, see, that's totally what I'm talking about... I can totally see people being curious about the /process/ or about our feelings about things, or whatever. Totally can see it no problem. So far, though, I haven't had too many people ask that way. Maybe it's semantics, but it seems like lots of people are all, "So who's this guy?" as if there's some guy I know and we're knocking boots. Which, eww, we're not.

To me it's more like a shopping list than a bunch of guys, you know?

~//~

Jen really wanted a donor that would in some way match her background/coloring. So I searched people with similar hair/eye color to Jen, then looked at ethnicity. We chose three, bought their profiles, and chose based on health history.

[prunesnprisms.livejournal.com]

wellll, it is a genetic fact of the matter right now that it takes one of each. It may not always be that way. I'll be all 'Ask Amy' here and tell you that if those kinds of questions bother you now, you should definitely have a pat answer soon, because you are going to get those questions for the next twenty+ years. It should be one of those that just cuts off discussion.

I see where you're coming from and wanting to defend Jen's right to be offended, but really are you offended by your friends asking or strangers? Because your friends know the route you chose and it's only natural that they might ask one or two questions about why this particular option was attractive. Strangers, however, are always going to be rude. That's why perfect strangers ask fat women like me how far along we are, or why pregnant women get their bellies touched. It's because as a society, we've become rude. I'd definitely work our your answer now--your friends know enough to not ask, if that's what you want--but there are several billion strangers in the world.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I didn't say they bothered me, just that they weirded me out a little bit. Not that I can't answer, just that the obsession with "the guy" is a little weird to me.

I can totally agree that this is not the first or the last time this is going to come up, and we have definitely thought/talked about how we would answer such questions. I'm just a little floored by how MANY there have been - not from strangers, but from friends. Strangers (and some friends, even) have no idea that we're even doing this, so I'm sure that stuff will come up when/if we actually get pregnant.

I don't particularly think of the questions as rude, just weird. I don't find questions about the process or the steps or the decisions weird. I guess because those are questions about US rather than about some mystery dude who probably jacked off to a magazine 5 years ago.

[lorac.livejournal.com]

I really hope people don't start touching my stomach. That freaks me out. I mean, friends can if they want to and ask, but strangers touching me freaks me the hell out.

[snack.livejournal.com]

i want to know why anonymous was better for you. because i feel the total opposite and sweetie feels like you. she wants NO GUY involved EVER. i want to know who the guy is.. a tangible, living breathing human being with a name and a story and a personality.

which is why i want to use a friend.

i want the child to be able to ask "where did the other half of me come from" and have that answer available. even if he dies, there's his partner, or the child's half sibling, etc. there could be that very tangible, very real connection to both sides of the child's genetic makeup.

but i don't understand why sweetie wants some anonymous batch of sperm.

so maybe you can talk about it and i'll understand?

[luloubelle.livejournal.com]

I agree with you... part of me wants the person to be someone I can point to and say, "that's him." Part of me wants my child to have a father figure in her life. Then again, I think I'll be that father figure and take it camping, teach it how to hammer a nail without bending it or smashing it's thumb, and none of that other stuff will matter because it will be mine and Allyson's child.

Everyone is going to have an opinion, but what matters is what Jude and Jen feel is right for THEM. I would never have thought to ask, "who's the guy?" I would just understand that regardless of the DONOR, the child will be Jude and Jen's child.

Even when a child is adopted, I can't stand when people say, "SoinSo's adopted child. It's their son, their daughter, their CHILD.

I love you Jude and Jen! You're an inspiration. Good Luck!

The brief skinny:

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I really wanted a known donor (for some of the reasons you stated)and Jen wasn't sure, but would have gone along with me if I'd really pushed. She preferred bank sperm but wasn't married to either idea, you know? We were actually looking into finding a friend... however, it was incredibly hard to find a decent dude who was willing to sign off all parental rights (which was very important to us, as we're not into legal coparenting with a donor).

What decided for us entirely was learning the laws/policies of having IUIs done in a doctor's office in Massachusetts. The state requires that IUIs are done with sperm that has been thoroughly tested for EVERYTHING, which also requires a 6 month quarantine period. (They also required me to be tested for everything, too.) If we wanted to use a friend, and still have IUIs which were recommended due to PCOS stuff, we would have had to wait at least 6 months AND pay for all of their extensive sperm screenings.

Bank sperm has already been tested and quarantined.

[oxlahun.livejournal.com]

I hadn't really thought about asking, but I think I can see how others would be curious.

This baby, yours and Jen's, is going to inherit some characteristics from a third person. Not only will no one (or at least no one who knows either of you) question the love of the kid's two moms, I'm sure everyone will love the kid as much as any of our other friends' children.

We're all excited for you. You're making someone new part of our world. Not nearly as intimately as he/she/it will be part of yours, of course, but still there. And we (collectively) want to know everything about that new person right now, because we're almost as impatient as you are about it.

I agree with Pru. If all goes well, it's going to be time very soon for you to get over people's nosiness and have an answer. I think "Jen" is a fine answer, btw. Or maybe expand just a little and respond to "Who's the father?" with "Jen and I are the parents." The rudest folks will press further, but you need only repeat that response.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I agree that there will be nosey people, and I agree that there has to be an answer. And I'm very willing and happy to be very candid about the process and the decisions and all of that, because those are things about US. Does that make sense?

When people ask us questions like, "What were you guys looking for in a donor?" or "Why did you decide on bank sperm instead of a known donor?" or any kind of question like that, it feels (to me, and I'm sometimes overly metacognitive or sensitive so YMMV) more like, well, like the people asking are interested in US, in OUR feelings, in OUR process.

Dude didn't really HAVE a process, you know? He spooged into a cup and got paid, the end. I have his health history and I will keep it for our baby (if we are so lucky) but I don't have so much as a /picture/. It's not a person... it's a little tiny vial of sperm. And yes, that tiny vial provides genetic material, health issues, etc... but not a parent. And not an equal partner.

So asking questions about "the guy" (to me) takes us out of the process and makes it about him. And I don't know why people care more about him than us.

The "guy"

[dianamarie.livejournal.com]

I didn't get to ask yet, but likely I would have, and not because I give a fig about him or ever would want to say that the child isn't yours and Jen's. I'm more on the page of wonedering if you picked out the semen because of genetic traits like hair/eye color which might match Jen, and what else were considered factors. The creation of a child between the two of you doesn't follow some of the more traditional methods, obviously, and some of the things it DOES involve are a bit of a mystery to me. Which is why I'm very glad you're journaling about it, and I'm hoping that it all works out well for the two of you! :)

Re: The "guy"

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Well, see, that's the thing:

If people want to know what we were looking for in a donor, that doesn't weird me out. Not even a little. (And I'll answer - we started with hair/eye color to match Jen, went to ethnic background as close to Jen as we could get, and then decided based on family health history.) Asking about what WE wanted in a donor is a question about US. Asking about "who the guy is" is a question about someone we never care to know (and who doesn't care to know us) and doesn't involve us at all.

It's not like we know what he's like... we just know his hair/eye color and crap.

[kungfoogirl.livejournal.com]

I would be curious about the stats of the donor.

Eye color.
Hair color.
Height.

But only because I'd be curious about the physical characteristics the baby will have.

But the donor isn't more than a collection of these kinds of stats.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

EXACTLY. This isn't a person, it's some sperm. We didn't buy a dad, we bought some genetic stuff. So ask about OUR preferences, not about HIS person. You know?

(BTW - hazel. brown. 5'10" and 170. Russian/Polish/Jewish. healthy.)

We tried to physically match Jen's coloring as best we could given limited (vague) information.

[siercia]

I'd not asked, because I figured that if you wanted to talk about it, you would.

But it is a somewhat curious thing - mostly because it's not something I'll ever have to go through, and I'm always interested in what other people's process is like. It's not so much about who the guy is, but about what choices you've made and why, and just what the process is like. I mean, I wouldn't have known that the sperm bank process is like you described, I think I would have expected some small bit of personality to be on display. It's interesting to learn the inner workings.

And I do agree with what some other people have said - be prepared for all kinds of questions from friends, acquaintances and total strangers, and know what you're going to say - whether you want to explain things or make people squirm doesn't matter, I don't think, but you should know how to do it, especially answers that stop the questions at the start.

I can't even remember some of the questions I got with Widget, but I had people ask me where I had "gotten" her (assuming foreign adoption, I guess), "what is she?" (ummm, a baby?), if she was my baby - all that because her skin is a few shades darker than mine. I imagine you'll get much of the same, particularly if the baby looks more like the donor than you.

[scirocco.livejournal.com]

Heh, yeah, my mother got similar questions, at a time when it was even a bigger deal than it is now.

[anitsirk.livejournal.com]

to me, that question is kind of like asking someone what position they fucked in when the baby was concieved. no one's business.

tell them you got your sperm from celebritysperm.com, then pick some totally offensive celebrity. tom cruise.

[ktmcda.livejournal.com]

hahahahaha!!!!

[hope-persists.livejournal.com]

my friends that are preggers (the lesbian couple) have the same problem with it. they find it totally offensive that everyone is so curious. they pick out random celebrity names and just give that as an answer. today it could be jon stewart, tomorrow it could be johnny depp. usually shuts people right now and sort of illuminates the fact that a)they dont want to talk about it and b)it's inappropriate.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I just want to know why people are so obsessed with THE GUY. I'm a diva. I want people to be obsessed about ME and JEN!

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

We decided against a known donor when two things happened:

1. We learned that it is incredibly difficult, expensive, and time-consuming to jump through all of the hoops with a known donor in order to clear all of the state's policies on sperm for in-office IUIs.

2. My doctor agreed to do everything he could to go to bat for me with my insurance company. (We'd thought about stepping back to known donor home insems when we ran out of money.)

It's not anyone's business but I have no problem at all talking about why we did what we did - WE, OUR choices. I love talking about us and our decisions and our feelings. I mean, they're ours and I'm very proud of them. I just feel uncomfortable answering inquiries not about me or us, but about a stranger that I will never know. It's just not something I would have considered. I'd have asked, "What were you looking for in a donor?" rather than "What is the guy like?" Subtle difference?

Dude, if strangers touch my belly in public, IT'S ON.

[scirocco.livejournal.com]

I don't think it's that surprising. People are naturally curious about such things. Strangers may ask because they just don't know. Friends may ask not meaning any offense, since they will assume you two will be good parents. I'm sure the issue of your dedication to YOUR child isn't an issue, at least for your friends. It's just curiosity. I'm not sure why it's such a big thing to get that upset about for some people, either.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I can't answer for anyone who gets upset or offended, but I can tell you what makes it kind of weird for me. I hope that's okay.

It's weird to me because people are asking me questions not about me or us, but about someone we will never know. I don't feel comfortable answering questions about someone's personhood, because I don't know it! But if someone wants to know what we were looking for in a donor, what things we thought it was important (or not important) to have, bring it on! Be curious! Ask me anything at all about me or us or our process or our feelings - because that's what it is - OUR process. Not Dude's.

Does that make sense? And if it doesn't, please tell me. I like reading this stuff.

[siercia]

Amen to that.

Love knitting tiny things.

[afullmoon.livejournal.com]

I completely understand where you are coming from. To tell you the truth all I remember about my donor is he was healthy, tall and thin. I don't even know his number. The question I hate more is once you get pregnant people ask about everything and the procedure. They want exact details which I hate. It makes me feel like a science experiment. Or that my baby isn't a human. But I try to remember that people aren't being mean they are just curious.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

See, what matters to me isn't "what your donor is like" but what YOUR thought process was - what traits you were looking for, why you were looking for them, stuff like that. I want to know what was important to you. I want to know questions about YOU. I don't want to talk to you about someone you don't even know, someone you will never know, someone who will never be an actual part of your life. Sure, some of his genetic material will be a part of your life, but not a person.

I'm sorry you feel like someone's science experiment. :(

[stapynam.livejournal.com]

one day the kid may want to know a little about him. how much you and jen love each other and will love this child does not change the fact that there IS someone else involved. acknowledging it does not threaten or compete with the fact that it will be yours and jen's kid, it's just what is. if you are going to love ALL of this kid, this part of the story needs to be integrated into the love, not denied. just my thoughts:)

[kieron.livejournal.com]

You are right - one day our child may wantto know and then again they may notand we will deal with it as it comes for our child. I am not being a jerk here - my brothers are my hlaf borthers (this is my shining example!) and one wanted to know his dad - because he actually remembered him as a kid. The other brother has never wanted anything to do with him. So it still is a toss up...I guess Jude is more taken aback by people other than the potential child asking these questions, you know?

[estrange.livejournal.com]

It's just intriguing I guess. I wonder what he looks like & what his personality is & things like that. If I adopted I would wonder the same thing about both parents, you know? I know the child will be loved & that you & Jen are the parents but I can't help but being curious.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

But why do you wonder those things? I mean, I'm going to have his semen injected into my uterus and *I* don't wonder those things? I don't care what his personality is like and I don't care what he looks like, except that he has the same hair/eye color as My Jennifer. I don't have a photo and I don't have a personality inventory, I have some basic characteristics and a health history and really, that's good enough for me. I'm glad he doesn't have a lot of health issues in his family, that some of his grandparents are still alive in their 80s and 90s. I'm glad he has brown hair and hazel eyes.

But that doesn't say anything about him... it only says some stuff about genetic goo. Which is what it is to me - not a person. Sure, a person contributed that goo, but it's not like I'll ever meet him!

[oddharmonic.livejournal.com]

I haven't thought about asking you, but people here that know that Vogon isn't Laurel's bio-dad often ask about her sperminator.

I tell them that she looks a lot like photos of him at that age, but she also looks like a lot like her maternal aunts did at that age too.

One person pressed to hear what he looked like, so I told them the physical stats that kungfoogirl mentioned -- eye color, hair color, height, and that he was slightly heavyset but most of his family I'd seen pictures of wasn't.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I just don't know why people care who HE is. Who cares? We don't care.

We knew what we were looking for and we knew what was important and what wasn't. We know we want to keep the health history for future reference and that we wanted someone with longevity in his history. But that doesn't say anything about him as a person, which (to me) is what questions like, "What's the guy like?" are looking for.

He's not my friend, so I can't talk about him like one. He's not going to be a part of our lives... but hopefully what he did to make some extra money WILL be! :)

[kat-chan.livejournal.com]

Wow, this is a toughy. I would never think to ask, because I knew you went with anonymous donation for a reason.

On the other hand, being the child of an adopted child, I know some part of me really wishes that I knew about my genetic background because of how that would impact my medical history. It's really difficult to fill out a family history when all you know is your one parent's family background, and then what your other parent has had. But that's information that you'll have access to, at least to some degree, and you can provide to your child when the time is appropriate, too. And, again, it's noone's business other than yours.

I'm sure that those who ask just want to express an interest in what is happen and let you know that they are interested. But it still seems pretty gauche, too. Especially when they know the circumstances.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Well, when it comes to family history, I /do/ have a record from the bank that lists as much family history info as they have. And of course I want to keep this information for the sake of any kids.

Thing is, I don't even care if people want to know what we were looking for in a donor, or why we didn't go with a known donor, or whatever. it's not the curiosity that weirds me out, it's the way it's worded. Very few people have asked me about our feelings, our preferences, our desires, or our process. Yet they want me to tell them "what the guy is like." How should I know? I just know what we were looking for. You know?

Does that make sense?

[calledmara.livejournal.com]

You know it never even occurred to me to ask about the guy. I've been thinking about it as "the sperm." I mentioned to some friends you guys had bought sperm but I guess I sort of think of it like going to buy groceries or something, not really having a person attached. Though you probably can't steal sperm by using the self-checkout like when shopping at Kroger.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Yes! It is not a guy, it is sperm! And the sperm has certain genetic stuff in it, and I have a nice little print out that I will keep, but I don't have answers about a person I don't know. I have words on a paper, and that's it. I can only talk about what WE want and what WE chose.

When you talk about the self-checkout, all I can think about is the commercial that's out now about a dude going through the U-Scan and he's trying to buy wart remover and the machine gets stuck... it keeps saying "wart remover" over and over. HA!