(no subject)

[judecorp]

Barack Obama, June 5, 2006

And I should say that personally, I do believe that marriage is between a man and a woman.

Just in case y'all think he's a friend to the gays.

Comments

[folkyboy.livejournal.com]

ya hurd!

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I like to keep things to myself.

re: friend of the gays

[etherial.livejournal.com]

On the issues:

Include sexual orientation in anti-discrimination laws.
Let each denominations decide on recognizing gay marriage.
We need strong civil unions, not just weak civil unions.

The full text of the speech you quoted includes:

This debate is an attempt to break a consensus that is quietly being forged in this country. It's a consensus between Democrats and Republicans, liberals and conservatives, Red States and Blue States, that it's time for new leadership in this country - leadership that will stop dividing us, stop disappointing us, and start addressing the problems facing most Americans.

It's a consensus between a majority of Americans who say, "You know what, maybe some of us are comfortable with gay marriage right now and some of us are not. But most of us do believe that gay couples should be able to visit each other in the hospital and share health care benefits; most of us do believe that they should be treated with dignity and have their privacy respected by the federal government."

Re: friend of the gays

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Oh, I know. I totally have the whole speech. And you know, if he wins the primary, I'll vote for him. What can I say, I'm easily bought. ;) But I think it's funny that a lot of queer folk I've been following for a while are all "Obama = God" and talking about how he loves the gays and we're going to have national marriage as soon as he's elected and blah blah blah.

Just pointing out the facts. :)

[llunabelle.livejournal.com]

WTF?

I.just.don't.under.stand.

I hear that all the time from just about every politician and yet I'm no closer to seeing the logic. What does that mean? Why is marriage between a man and a woman? I even heard a "person" say that once! Clearly they were just repeating the things their television told them to as they could offer no further explanation however hard I pried.

Yeah. Obama. Just in case anyone though he was an actual person. :-

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I wish I had answers for you, I really do.

I can understand saying, "Maybe civil unions are better, blah blah blah, political talk," but I don't really understand the "Marriage is between one man and one woman" crap. I just don't. Maybe HIS marriage is, but mine isn't.

[lunapoppy.livejournal.com]

Well, what I look for in a politician is how they will vote or enact laws DESPITE how they feel personally. He may not LIKE gay marriage, but will he allow it? Who knows. Hillary is no better on this issue. Given what we have been living with for the past 8 years, I have to believe that things will get better for us when a Dem is in office (and yeah, I know all the fukt crap B Clinton did to us). God, it has to get better. Both Obama and Clinton have said they support immigration rights for gay couples, and I have to hold onto that hope since right now there is no way for me to keep my partner here after she finishes school.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I agree that I hope that things will be better if a Dem is in office. Hope. No guarantee. Not from any of them. Especially since we all learned a lesson when B. Clinton heavily courted the HRC and then pushed through all of that crap legislation. I just don't know why so many people are so convinced that Obama is pro-gay. Neither of them are going to come out and say they're pro-gay. It's like a political death sentence. But I think this quote goes too far.

And yeah, I hope for that for you also. xo

[tea-soaked.livejournal.com]

We had no immigration rights in the US or the UK so we moved to Canada.

[tea-soaked.livejournal.com]

Are any of them okay with the gays?


I wish Canadian politicians could talk to American politicians on this issue. When same sex marriage became legal here I remember Chretian (prime minister at the time) saying something to the effect if it is illegal to discriminate then it is illegal to not allow certain people the choice to marry. It was met with opposition. But I think he used his veto power to basically tell everyone to shut up and there really is no debating this issue. And then everyone moved on.

And God didn't strike anyone dead.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that's what I don't understand at all... why it's a big deal. What's so freaking scary about a bunch of queers getting married? It's become this whole stupid ordeal around here (well, not HERE but here in the US) like God is just waiting to smite everyone if the queers get to have marriage licenses. I mean, God hasn't blown up Massachusetts yet.

And no - none of the front runners are speaking out in favor of same-sex marriage. Just the people who never stood a chance.

[checkingmypulse.livejournal.com]

I don't really consider any of them (that are left) "friends" to us. Sad, but true.

Hillary really isn't any better than Obama.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

You're right - Clinton isn't pro- same-sex marriage, either. However, she hasn't (that I can find) come out and said that she personally believes marriage is for a man and a woman. Instead, she said that she was in favor of civil unions for NY but if the majority wanted same-sex marriage, then so be it.

[eeka13.livejournal.com]

He did say "personally" though. And no, none of the front runners are coming right out and saying they support, well, anyone. They have to do the middle-of-the-road bullshit to get anywhere. Grr.

But what I want in a candidate is someone who has strong personal beliefs but DOESN'T think everyone else needs to hold them. I personally think it's atrocious for anyone to eat another creature, but if I were a politician, I wouldn't start drafting laws outlawing it, because I don't think everyone needs to agree with me. My personal beliefs aren't the same as what I think everyone in the country needs to follow in order for it to be a good country.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Of course they're not going to come out and stick their necks out and stick up for people. BUT WHY NOT? That's what makes our country sucky, IMO. Everyone is "moderate" and nothing changes. Because, you know, we don't want to ruffle any feathers. Well eff that!

I am totally cool with a candidate having personal beliefs and different ideas for the country. I don't entirely think that's possible when you're talking about someone's spiritual beliefs all the time (some people can do it, not all people can), and in order to know if someone is the sort who can personally believe one thing and do another in practice, you need to have info about the practice.

That's where he's lacking for me.

[oppendonnell.livejournal.com]

I miss Kucinich. Sniff. My sister says he believes in UFOs. Whatever...UFOs and gay marriage. Yeah.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

UFOs and gay marriage

Word.

[vttwinmama.livejournal.com]

word, jude!

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Word indeed!

[vttwinmama.livejournal.com]

oh, that is too funny. i posted that last comment before your previous reply. you and me...we are all about the "word"s!

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I think we just have a lot of soul. :)

[scirocco.livejournal.com]

This is a thorn for me about him. However, what someone else said below, what HE personally believes, versus what laws he'd try to pass about it.... That's where I'm more confused about what he'd do.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

Right. Me, too. I don't really entirely care what he thinks "personally" (although I think a lot of times politicians say this to try to appease both sides), but there is no way to really know what he would do in practice, because his voting record is almost non-existent.

I like to have info. INPUT. MORE INPUT NUMBER FIVE!

[mlove.livejournal.com]

no he didn't.

[zuzubailey76.livejournal.com]

THANK YOU.

[amyura.livejournal.com]

The thing that gets me about the gay marriage issue is that there is NO logical reason to be against gay marriage that doesn't involve either religious convictions or some sort of visceral aversion to "TEH GEYZ." Last time I checked, neither of those was constitutionally valid.

[eeka13.livejournal.com]

I've thought that too. Like, what if every marriage had to be sanctified by SOME sort of organized community along with its leaders? For most of us, it would probably be a religious or religious-derived sort of community. For people who don't like traditional religion, this could encourage them to have tighter and more organized community groups, because these groups could register as groups that are allowed to solemnize marriages. As long as you had enough people who communicated regularly and had some sort of organized practices, you could get your marriage solemnized by your Dungeons and Dragons group, or your environmental coalition, or your softball league, or whoever.

BTW, in Germany, there's an actual civil ceremony (not just signing of a paper that you can drop off), so you have to have two ceremonies, one religious (or community-based), and one civil. Pretty cool, really.

[kitkatkaboodle.livejournal.com]

i fall on this where i fall on him and abortion. he doesn't personally agree with abortion either but he isn't going to try to overturn roe v wade.

[lelumama.livejournal.com]

this is how I feel too.

I don't think I'm ever going to find a candidate, ANY candidate, whose beliefs and ideals exactly match mine. I have to try to choose who will do the best on behalf of EVERYONE, or at the very least, the less harm (like 4 years ago).

I'm sorry that this is still an issue for anyone...you should be able to marry who you love without the government playing Tetris with your genitals. Period.

[lickingtoad.livejournal.com]

Hilary, in my experience, says exactly what she needs to say to stay in office/get re-elected/get elected to something better. She's a consummate politician, and thus a consummate shark. (I once said I fear no animal what is delicious, and sharks are, but I never want to be attacked by a shark.)

Barack, as has been said, sounds *hopeful.* Like no-one else since ... probably since before I was born. I guess I'm a sucker for optimism, after having my genitals become the target of a gas-powered pitchfork gun for eight years running. (Seriously, his re-election was the day after my birthday. 'Happy birthday, queer! You're even more not-a-person!' Ugh.)

[kcmedc.livejournal.com]

At this point I hope that when we get all the rights it's called anything but Marriage. I hope somebody finally actually separates church from state and laws are called one thing and the religious ceremony is called marriage. Besides "marriage" seems to have a curse around it. You and Jen are the only couple that I know who have gotten "married" and stay that way. Those of us "living in sin" are still together. As far as any Dem being for us, Dennis is the only one willing to hang his neck out.

I'm backing Obama

[(Anonymous)]

UMMM...Hillary thinks that marriage is between a man and woman as well

Maybe you're another racist "progressive" white lesbian who would never vote for Obama when a white woman candidate is available

from: http://www.ontheissues.org/2008/Hillary_Clinton_Civil_Rights.htm

Hillary supports DOMA, which Bill Clinton signed

Hillary stated categorically that she opposed legalizing same-sex marriage. She provided a clear explanation that to this day is the most quoted statement enunciating her position. "Marriage has historic, religious, and moral content that goes back to the beginning of time, and I think a marriage is as a marriage has always been, between a man and a woman. But I also believe that people in committed gay marriages, as they believe them to be, should be given rights under the law that recognize and respect their relationship."

Hillary said she backed her husband's signing of the Defense of Marriage Act. She said what everyone wanted to know: Yes, if she had been in the Senate in 1996, she would have supported the law.

Re: I'm backing Obama

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I never stated who I was voting for, dude.

Step off.

[shellipsm.livejournal.com]

May the record show that my BLACK partner voted for Hillary.

And so did I, and so did our BLACK Daughter.

Whatever.

Sheesh.

[judecorp.livejournal.com]

I'm so glad Malka got out and voted!

Punk voted for Hillary, too.